Atwood crosses the line
Mike Duffy often marvels at how ‘generous’ Canada is, to allow certain politicians to openly promote the breakup of our country - a concept that would appear almost treasonous in some areas of the world.
Not only that, but their salaries and pensions are funded by hard-working Canadians.
And so we have Gilles Duceppe starting his own ABC campaign in Toronto, to stir up animosity against Harper and his position on arts funding. This is bad enough. I really feel Duceppe should stay in Quebec.
However, when Margaret Atwood comes out and says that if she lived in Quebec she would vote for the Bloc, I think she’s gone too far. This is a woman who is a recipient of the Order of Canada, and she is promoting a party whose main goal is the breakup of our country! Not even Danny Williams has taken that outrageous step.
And make no mistake - Duceppe’s message is still anti-Canada :
But the Duceppe speech stole the show - and he did not shy away from his sovereignist message either, telling the crowd "sovereignty is alive and well in Quebec." He argued it’s the "best solution," for Quebec and Canada.
On top of this, Atwood moans about all the related jobs that would be lost due to arts cuts:
The author used carrion imagery to explain what happens arts funding is cut. "When a caribou dies, 52 other organisms gain their living from that caribou," she told reporters. "The arts are like that caribou. They are the caribou, but all kinds of other people in all kinds of other jobs gain their living in relation to the arts. So it’s the restaurants, it’s the people that work in the restaurants, it’s the hotels, it’s the people who work in the hotels, it’s the transport, it’s the people who work in transport, it’s the corner stores in those places that have festivals it’s all of those things. It’s all connected."
Ms. Atwood admitted some people might find her metaphor to be "a funny one."
Bizarre might be a better word.
But in any case, her metaphor ignores the fact that westerners are concerned precisely about the same thing when Jack Layton talks about cuts to "Big Oil", forgetting that there are a lot of workers sitting around the kitchen table out west who would be affected by such action. (Mary T and Paul also make some eloquent observations on how cutting ‘Big Oil’ would adversely affect the whole country in comments from the previous post.)
Yes, Layton conveniently ignores the ‘working families’ in Alberta. Of course, he doesn’t expect to get many votes there.
Personally, I can understand how Quebecers feel that their culture is part of their identity and I do believe that it should be protected. I also don’t pretend to understand how all the funding works, but my very naive approach would be to give each province a certain amount of cash for arts and let them decide where to dole it out. Then the premiers can deal with the complaints.
But for Margaret Atwood to openly support and promote a party that wants to threaten the unity of our country is unconscionable.
* * * *
Update: Margaret Atwood would vote for the separatist party - Russ Campbell’s blog.
Canada First? - Chuckercanuk.
Afternoon Update : From Spector Vision - Duceppe’s Useful Idiot.
Fighting for taxpayers - Separatist Atwood gets art funding wrong.
(H/T National Newswatch)
October 4th, 2008 at 8:39 am
So let’s look at that “carrion” another way. Say the carrion represents the things most important to Canadians. You have those who are truly hungry and need that carrion for food and then you have those organisms that naturally live off food that others need - maggots.
Now don’t get me wrong - I am NOT portraying artists as maggots - Margaret used the carrion analogy - I am just viewing it from outside the art world.
My thinking on it is that if arts have become the defining issue in this election - Canadians have nothing to worry about.
I wonder where Margaret would put “arts” on Maslow’s hierarchy of needs. I wonder if she realizes that if people don’t have jobs - art is NOT the thing foremost in people’s minds.
October 4th, 2008 at 8:54 am
I’ll put it another way. If that caribou dies, another will come along behind it shortly after. and that dead caribou most likely sired other caribou to carry on when it was no longer with us.
If I was going to use an example, it would be a carp. They are everywhere. Some people like them, but most people find them annoying. A carp is like a subsidized artist. When fishing and you catch one, the fight was ok but you are somewhat peeved that it wasn’t a real game fish.
By the way Joanne, go over to Warren K. and read his latest post. I’m sure it will perk up your weekend (and others as well).
October 4th, 2008 at 8:57 am
And a quick note to Margret Atwood. If the Bloc gains strenght and power and were successful in gaining Quebec seperation, those Quebec artists you claim to care about would lose their CANADIAN FUNDING.
Sheesh.
October 4th, 2008 at 8:57 am
I wonder where Margaret would put “arts” on Maslow’s hierarchy of needs. I wonder if she realizes that if people don’t have jobs - art is NOT the thing foremost in people’s minds.
Well said.
And then there’s the issue of individual responsiblity vs. entitlement: By all means, explore your artistic side and develop it. Stephen Harper is encouraging that with the Children’s Arts Tax Credit.
But it is always wise to have a backup plan, so the parent should also be ensuring that the child has a solid alternative skill or academic background in another field, even if he or she wishes to pursue a career in the arts. It’s just common sense.
October 4th, 2008 at 8:59 am
Funny too how you never hear Gilles mention this.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:08 am
I have never read any of her books. After all the attacks during the debates about wrong direction, wrong decisions etc I agree with AG. If the most important thing in this election is the ARTS, then PMSH has done a great job in steering the economy, financial institutions, health care, and so many other areas, in the right direction. Therefore we as good canadians we should reward his great stewardship with a huge majority. If the ARTS are the main concern it means all the other leaders in the debate were spewing lies, everything is great, and we are not going to hell in a handbasket.
Don’t need changes to EI, the ARTS will support all those without jobs. Don’t need manufacturing jobs, the ARTISTS will support our needs. Don’t need foodbanks, GALAS will fill the need.
At one time canadians took chances, left their homes from across the ocean, or got on wagon trains, or trains, or just a horse, and set out for a new life.
They come to Canada and made great lives and a great country. Guess they should have stayed home and went to an opera or museum.
There was a saying, go west young man, go west. That saying is just as true today. The west has the jobs, lifestyle, schools, and everything else to make a good life. As an aside we even have culture, the arts, artists, festivals, musicians, gallerys, museums and writers.
We in the west will continue to prosper, while those in Quebec and Ont might continue to lose out, but at least they will have their ARTISTS. Try heating your home or feeding your family on ART.
Let the PM explain what was cut and how much. If as Layton says artists only earn about 10-12 thousand a year, is that their only income. If that is all they can earn perhaps they should get another job as they are not producing what canadians will buy. Are they full time artists or is that their hobby and they make a few dollars. Name me one cdn movie, with nothing but cdn actors or actresses that has been a blockbuster. Should we call all those in Alberta that have been involved with american movies artists.
Last year my husband was asked to make some props for a movie being shot here. Is he an artist.
And if Gilles has 2 kids in the movie business in Quebec, isn’t that a conflict of interest when he lobbies for more money for them.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:14 am
Paul, thanks for the tip about Kinsella. My eyes welled up a bit when I read the part about Harper calling his mother.
Might do a follow-up post latter. You know, political differences aside, Warren’s a good guy.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:30 am
As the first member of the BlueSweaterBrigade allow me to be the first to ask this question of Atwood.
Has her success been based on subsidies from the government, OR, can she claim natural talent? If she hadn’t found a niche market internationally and south of the border in the USA, would she be cozying up to the separatists, or will she give back her Order of Canada medal because she’s supporting a party that wants to rip Canada apart.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:33 am
‘Blue Sweater Brigade’. Heh. I love it!
BTW, Harper is on CTV live from Halifax right now.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:38 am
Dion’s on now. I wonder what he’s got hiding under that red sweater?
October 4th, 2008 at 9:39 am
Just caught PMSH making his announcement, restoring many cuts to programs made by the liberals. Funny, where was the outrage in Quebec when they cut 50 million from economic developement.
Reporter (female) just asked him question, and managed to get Mike Harris, in their.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:42 am
Oops, back to Harper. I’m getting dizzy.
Dominic LeBlanc looked ill standing behind Dion.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:43 am
BlueSweater trumps Red Sweater every time. Copy cats…they figure if it works for Steve(and it is) that it might work for Dion.
Truth is that you could wrap Dion in a cabbage roll and you’d still need to hit the bathroom soon after.
I had to laugh at the pics. of Dion in my paper this morning of him scoring a goal in a street hockey game, because when I saw it on TV last night the commentator made the point of saying the Dion made a half a dozen attempts at scoring a goal before he scored.
Harper would have made that net in one shot, guaranteed!
Saw the Layton ads also last night ramped-up, but get this, before the debate I had a different feel for Layton and those ads than I do now. I see him very differently after the bullying and anger he displayed towards Mr. Harper.
I think that the bad, mad, angry and bullying descriptors should be trained directly at Layton, because he emerged as such in my mind.
October 4th, 2008 at 9:56 am
PMSH just got in a few digs at NFLD and Quebec, in a nice way, -why anyone would want to be in the bleachers instead of the table-paraphrased. Governments make decisions with assistance of the caucus. If you have members at the table they can bring to the govts attention problems facing their areas. Governments act, opposition reacts.
Said something that he thinks voters today vote on what is best for them, not how their grandfather voted. Why would anyone not want someone at the table.
I like how he referred to the Bloc, as being in the bleachers. Mentioned how the carbontax will hit Atlantic areas very hard in the cost to heat their homes.
He must be making stmts that scare the cbc, they are breaking away from the press conference to follow important stories, (thats what she said_
October 4th, 2008 at 10:01 am
And what is that important story, OJ found guilty.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:15 am
I am going to buy blue sweaters for hubby and myself.
Sweater suits PMSH, does not fit with Dion. He needs a vest, pocket watch and suspenders. Yes, LeBlanc is about to cry.
Dion is asked, when will you go into any riding held by conservatives, instead of trying to hold liberal ridings. Ouch.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:19 am
The government has increased funding to Arts, not decreased it, which makes Duceppe and Atwood dishonest propagandists. Coupled with Atwood’s support of the Bloc, in my eyes she’s completely undermined her credibility.
Quebecers who are turning to the Bloc due to the lie about Arts funding are hypocrites. The Bloc represents Quebec independence yet they are all turning to the Bloc in order to increase their dependency on the rest of Canada.
They are also supremely arrogant. They put their Quebec culture above the anglophone family. Each dollar the government forcibly takes from me and my family in support of Quebec culture is one less dollar I have to benefit my family. Guess which one I think is more important. Guess which one any rational family would find more important, especially when, if we are to believe the socialist parties, Canadians are clamouring for ever more government services.
If Quebecors think their culture is so important, then it’s up to them to put their money where their mouths are, not the rest of Canada.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:21 am
I had read that story of how he phoned WK’s mother before and it did move him. I think he will vote conservative this time. He says PMSH will win a huge majority or small minority. Love the was he bashes liberals who have the wrong idea of Alberta.
Ouch, another question, are you just trying to save the furniture by going to liberal ridings.
McCeever (sp) calls it quits. Another NDP goes under the bus.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:27 am
Note to CPC campaign!! Start stocking those blues sweaters as the best CPC marketing tool in decades.
Second best….hire me(kidding, sort of)but just think of the possibilities, we start with blue sweaters, and move to blankets, earmuffs, slippers….all of those comforts that make us feel truly Canadian.
Try a BlueSweater Cocktail before dinner tonight or a BlueSweater hot liquor drink by that fireplace. The suggestions for recipes starts here today.
We already own blue sweaters in my family. Actually both men in my family have them - now there’s special meaning in that.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:39 am
BlueSweaterCosy(hot liquor drink)
one shot rum
half-shot maple syrup
dash cinnamon
Stir
Top with whipped cream and one of those maple sugar maple leafs you find in any Canadian gift store.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:42 am
Joanne, Kinsella’s post is a reassuring one, but I have to disagree with this part:
“The time will come - soon and soon enough, too - when we will again go in search of an erudite, over-achieving intellectual, and the Everyman will be discarded like last year’s election pamphlets.”
That implies Mr. Harper is not an “erudite, over-achieving intellectual.”
Perhaps my perception of Mr. Harper is coloured by my partisanship, but I believe he’s both the Everyman and just as much the erudite intellectual Kinsella describes, despite what author Yann Martel and other ‘artistes’ think:
http://www.whatisstephenharperreading.ca/
On good authority - Dr. J’s blog (I don’t provide a link because my comment would end up in the filter) - here’s a partial list of some well-thumbed books Mr. Harper may have on his bookshelves:
“Bureaucracy (von Mises; 130 pages) may help re-form his view of the internal workings of the state; The Road to Serfdom (Hayek, 266 pages) might make him think about what threatens individual liberty; Out of my Life and Thought (Albert Schweitzer, 296 pages) a deeper look by one of the last century’s great humanitarians; God and Man at Yale (Buckley, 240 pages) would inform on an academic world he may not be familiar with; The Communist Manifesto (you know who, 80 pages) might surprise him to know how two dead sausage-eaters still affect tax and social policy in Canada; and even Homage to Catalonia (Orwell, 264 pages) showing the experience of a former “progressive”.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:42 am
TangoJuliette sez:
Maggie Atwood, at least to this Quebec Allophone, certainly sounds like some sort of twigged-out and slightly demented anti-Harperaniac mentally-unhinged individual.
Does she know nothing of Separatist / bloc / pqueistes / FLQ viciousness? Ididots like Reggie Chartrand, the RIN lunatics, the remebered dead like Army Demolitions Expert Walter Leja relegated to a lifetime of serious disability when he was ordered to dismantle a mail-box bomb in wealthy Anglo-Westmount, only to have it explode in his hands, inflicting on him, most horrific damage and suffering?
Or how about Montreal Army Recruitment Center Security Guard Commisionaire O’Neill killed in an FLQ terrorist bombing of said Center.
There are many more similar tragic death.
Atwood, the hate-filled Canadian pseudo-Icon[?]seems prepared to sacrifice the Unity of the Nation, in the wrong-headed logic that this could help her favourite cause, stopping a Harper majority at any cost.
No need here for democratic debate, discourse and the secret ballot to unseat someone she despises. Hell no, rip the country asunder! What a totalitarian and dictatorial horse’s arse she proves herself to be.
Maybe somewhere soon there will be a jeweller / artiste who can come up with a shattered version of an updated insignia for the new Order of a Fragmented Canada. I’d gladly suggest that Mags be the Patron Buffoon.
I have found Ms. Atwood’s thinking in this instance to be profoundly treasonous and extremely disgusting. I have no option other than to conclude that beyond any shadow of a doubt, Margaret Atwood is living proof that, indeed, Liberalism IS a progessively degenerative mental disorder.
tj
t.e.& o.e.
October 4th, 2008 at 10:46 am
P.S.: I love the “Blue Sweater Brigade” idea.
You’re so creative. and you didn’t need any arts funding to be that creative, either. Congrats!
October 4th, 2008 at 10:50 am
I must say,that early this Sat.morn..reading Warren’s post,and the mention of PMSH’s phone call to his Mom has me a little misty-eyed.This is the man we see,the man that has been so demonized by the arrogant ‘must have power at any cost’ Liberals,and the msm perpetuate that trash.
As for Atwood,I have never understood the attention she has received..another arrogant media hound..maybe we could have a double recinding of OofC,with her and Morgentaler!
October 4th, 2008 at 10:58 am
Today Dion reveals his Economic Plan:
”Dion pledges to act ‘right away’ on Tories’ $33B infrastructure plan”
…Mr. Dion indicated a Liberal government response to what he called the “economic crisis” would require adjustments to the party’s $55-billion electoral platform. …
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=ae4ca32e-20d1-4fec-94b7-f8c6bd755bd8
Can you believe it? The Liberal platform is less than 2 weeks old and is already back in the shop for alterations!
H E L L O…Liberals, did yah just get the memo that the economy is headed for rough waters?.
October 4th, 2008 at 11:01 am
TangoJuliette, you should consider sending your comment to the Globe and Mail, among other newspapers, as a letter to the editor.
It is amazing how many so-called progressives are advising Canadians to subvert our electoral system: people like Elizabeth May, Danny Williams, Gilles Duceppe, those advising vote-swapping or strategic voting, and now these anti-Harper tirades from well-heeled artists.
I am a patron of the arts in my own way: I buy tickets to concerts, the opera, museums, books, CDs, etc.
I support the arts in that way.
Here’s a hint for the well-heeled artist who have reached stardom: why not set up a fund to help your less fortunate brothers and sisters in the arts?
Ms. Atwood, have you contributed lately to such a fund?
October 4th, 2008 at 11:30 am
BlueSweaterBreakfast - just in time for Thanksgiving
BlueSweater Coffee - your favourite brewed with just a hint of cinnamon.
BlueSweater Pancakes - shave an Ontario MacIntosh apple into the batter and cook as normal. Serve with the best maple syrup on the planet(Canadian of course) and rings of carmelized apples on top. Dust with icing sugar.
Serve with a helping of Canadian back bacon or Huron County port sausage.
Giving thanks for all Canada provides.
October 4th, 2008 at 11:38 am
and because the BlueSweaterBrigade doesn’t want to leave the Liberal out
Dion’s RedSweater Breakfast
pablum, instant coffee, served with cherniak coctail weenies(I can’t believe what this guy’s peddling on his blog re: Harper taking advantage of Jewish Canadians - how desperate can we go?)
No wine(or whine) until noon kids.
October 4th, 2008 at 11:50 am
I think Dion would be more of a tofu, perrier kind of guy.
Ya, Cherniak is really losing it. Yesterday he said Warren K. was not credible in anything he writes.
And the new Star poll has the Conservative’s down to 35%, but the Liberal’s at 22% and Dippers at 20%. I’ll take a 13 point spread, especially from The Star.
October 4th, 2008 at 11:54 am
OK, now is also the time to start selecting theme songs for the liberals and ndp and May for Oct 15.
Only one that comes to mind now is I’m so blue over you. Green aligator for May.
Anyway, I’m off the a fundraiser for the Children’s Wish Foundation and their annual Pumpkin festival.
Don’t think I will see any blue pumpkins. Great org and my g/sons wish to see the Star Wars Exhibit in Sydney Australia a few years ago is still the highlight of his life.
As an added benefit LOL the gay games were going on and I shocked everyone back home by attending the opening of same. Sat two rows behind Fergie. That red hair can’t be missed. And I did see katie lang preform. No big deal.
Will have lots of comments to read tonight, I am sure.
October 4th, 2008 at 12:03 pm
If you listen to that woman, Atwood, drone on in an interview, you know, YOU JUST KNOW, that she is a few bricks short of a load, and that she quite possibly arrived here from another planet.
Another good Order of Canada recipient!! That medal has no valuable meaning anymore.
October 4th, 2008 at 12:07 pm
Still waiting for my ride and visited SDA. Kate has another good contest going on. Go give your ideas.
October 4th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Haven’t had time to read all the comments on your VERY ACTIVE blog Joanne, but my first thought when I saw the Atowod refernce was :Hands up if you are able to get thru any of her boring literature…ugh!
And I’ve been thinking for awhile , and hoping that Toronto should have it’s own seperatist movement and become the Soverign State of Socialism….She could be ‘in charge’ in charge and Miller her second hand man.They could probably aquire Jack and Olivia in some kind of cabinet.Duceppe could be their advisor.
Please..just…go…and leave your Order of Canada trinkets at the door!
October 4th, 2008 at 1:37 pm
…Perhaps my perception of Mr. Harper is coloured by my partisanship, but I believe he’s both the Everyman and just as much the erudite intellectual Kinsella describes…
Gabby, I missed this earlier. Fascinating.
Can a person be both an ‘everyman’ and be brilliant at the same time? I can’t see why not.
October 4th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
I can say that I’ve never selected an Atwood novel of my own free will. I had to read a couple in Gr. 13(in the Ontario days when we had one and the pub was closed)
and bluetech is right….really tough reading and I’m pretty sure our country’s low literacy rate indicates that not many Canadians would have picked up their own copy.
They’re also very dark books if I recall.
October 4th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
Hey, the Sttar finally allowed one of my comments through. And I’m way ahead in the plus/minus for those who agree or disagree.
Read the numbers and compare!
In the 2006 election Conservative’s had 36% of the vote, The Liberal’s 30%, for a six-point spread. Compare that to the current 13 point spread. Majority? Probably not, but an increased minority looks certain. Let’s not forget, Chretien won a majority in 1997 with only 38% of the vote.
Posted by paulsstuff at 11:51 AM Saturday, October 04 2008
Agree 15|Disagree 1|Offensive
October 4th, 2008 at 2:17 pm
“McCeever (sp) calls it quits. Another NDP goes under the bus.”
Interesting how all these Libs and NDP are calling it quits - leaves the door open for their supporters to vote for the other - how much was planned?
October 4th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
“..another NDP goes under the bus”
Interesting point Alberta Girl.
Given that some loon put a red sweater on Mr. Dion today, I’m waiting to Layton to show up at his next rally/press conference/photoop in fuzzy feet pajamas…..cause for that guy nothing short of fuzzy feet PJs will smooth his rough edges…man I think he’s getting prematurely drunk with power. However, he still deserves the opposition - he showed up.
October 4th, 2008 at 2:28 pm
According to the Wikipedia entry on Margaret Atwood :
“While she is best known for her work as a novelist, her poetry is noteworthy. Many of her poems have been inspired by myths, and fairy tales, which were an interest of hers from an early age.” Myths and fairy tales - sounds about right.
Incidentally, “Atwood also published short stories in Playboy magazine.” I guess they didn’t want pictures.
October 4th, 2008 at 2:29 pm
Congrats, Paulsstuff.
“Let’s not forget, Chretien won a majority in 1997 with only 38% of the vote.”
And nobody ever brought that up as proof that the majority of Canadians opposed him, as they’ve constantly done with Mr. Harper.
How often have we seen the mantra that over 60% did not vote for Mr. Harper?
But did they go beyond that … to say that only 30.23% voted Lib., 17.48% NDP, 10.48% Bloc, and 4.48% Green?
October 4th, 2008 at 2:32 pm
“I think he’s getting prematurely drunk with power.”
Is that premature e-JACK-ulation?
October 4th, 2008 at 2:46 pm
Pretty good article at G&m titled Incremental Man by Jeffrey Simpson and Brian Laghi (it’s quite a history of PMSh) Lots of good stuff!
October 4th, 2008 at 2:56 pm
“Can a person be both an ‘everyman’ and be brilliant at the same time?”
I don’t see why not either, and I don’t have to go too far afield for an example, either.
October 4th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
Gabby at 2:32 - Nobody can touch you in the wit department.
October 4th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
Faut être fermé d’esprit en tabarnak pour penser que quelqu’un qui tient un discours “pro québec” tient forcément un discours “anti canada”.
Ca s’appelle des nuances mes amis les anglos, vous avez pas de mot pour ça?
October 4th, 2008 at 4:00 pm
Bonjour Jasmin.
October 4th, 2008 at 4:13 pm
This comment from Bob Fife on the trail with Dion in Maritimes is pretty telling: Bob says he just spoke to a prison guard,and guard told him the prisoners are all putting up big signs in their cells saying “vote Liberal” and the reason is,they are ’scared of PMSH’s tough on crime stance,and figure they will have to spend more time in jail! One more BIG reason to VOTE CONSERVATIVE! If the criminals hate it…it has to be right.
October 4th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
To Jasmine, Atwood’s sentiment was not “pro-Quebec”, it was quite simply anti-Harper. No nuance here, mon amie.
October 4th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Sammy, I saw that too. So, let’s see.
Now the ABC campaign includes Danny Williams, Margaret Atwood, criminals and the CAW. Nice crew.
October 4th, 2008 at 4:44 pm
“Is that premature e-JACK-ulation? ;-)”
Classic!!! Ha Ha
October 4th, 2008 at 4:59 pm
‘…prisoners are all putting up big signs in their cells saying “vote Liberal”…’
LOL, waiting for the caption contest on that one!!
October 4th, 2008 at 5:45 pm
Jad @ October 4th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
“To Jasmine, Atwood’s sentiment was not “pro-Quebec”, it was quite simply anti-Harper. No nuance here, mon amie.”
Bravo!
Joanne, “Gabby at 2:32 - Nobody can touch you in the wit department.”
Not quite. MaryT’s wit, among others …
And by coincidence, David Akin’s blog has a similar pun about something else.
But I swear on my honour, I read Akin’s after posting here.
October 4th, 2008 at 6:14 pm
I hope Atwood’s comments get wide reportage. More votes for the CPC.
Anyone who would seriously suggest voting for a separatist/treasonist party is a f*^king moron.
October 5th, 2008 at 1:10 am
“Treasonist”…
Ha ha ha! What about all the french speakers who don’t at all recognise themselves in the “canadians indentity”?
If I hadn’t made up my mind by now, you’d have convinced me to vote for the bloc just by your narrow minded comments.
But I was already gonna vote for them anyways.
October 5th, 2008 at 6:59 am
So Jasmin - So you believe that Quebec should separate from Canada?
October 5th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
For anyone interested the fundraiser I went to yesterday netted 26,000, bet one yet. They had sold 58 dozen hotdogs by noon. Usually doesn’t get busy till about 1.00p.m.’ Cheers to the Children’s Wish Foundation.
October 5th, 2008 at 11:43 pm
Yes.
October 6th, 2008 at 12:21 am
If I hadn’t made up my mind by now, you’d have convinced me to vote for the bloc just by your narrow minded comments.
But I was already gonna vote for them anyways.
Don’t let the door hit your ass on the way out. Don’t forget to hand over your Canadian passport when you leave. This country doesn’t need you.
October 6th, 2008 at 12:22 am
What a hateful comment. You only give Canadians a bad name.
October 6th, 2008 at 12:55 am
No, actually Canadians like yourself (and you are one), who use our health care system, our social policies, but lend their fealty to separatist governments, give Canadians a bad name. Since you weren’t likely raised by wolves, I must blame it on you, and not your environment.
October 6th, 2008 at 7:06 am
Actually, I do appreciate Jasmin commenting here. It is an opportunity to try to understand what goes on in the mind of a separatist.
So Jasmin, could you please explain how you envision your country if what you wish for actually did happen?
October 6th, 2008 at 2:38 pm
Moebius, you seem to be unaware of the fact that Healthcare is a provincial jurisdiction and Quebec is not part of the Medicare system but has its own, independant healthcare system, RAMQ. So I do not use “your” healthcare.
And the part about “using YOUR social policies”, could you please elaborate a little more? I’m trying to make some sense out of this You use big words but your message is shallow and you do not back it up.
You do, however, sadly perpetuate the stereotype of the angy, french hating canadian. You might consider that a victory, considering your twisted viewpoints.
Joanne: It’s nice to have an open minded person to discuss with.
So you asked me if I was an idependantist myself. Yes I am. Why? My main and ultimate reason is pretty simple: I do not feel canadian. Canada is an all right country and I’d much rather live in Canada than the US. We share parts of our history with Canada too. But it’s still not “my” country. I do not feel like I belong in Canada. I feel alienated by the institutions, the traditions and the culture of this country. When people ask me what are my origins (I am a quarter native so I have a “not totally a white person” appearance I guess, because I get that question often) i do not answer “I am canadian”, I say “Je suis Québécois” because that’s how I feel (and I’m far from being the only that feels this way).
So I believe North American Francophones deserve to have their own state, we need the right to self determination.
So yeah, I hope it’s a satisfactory answer. And I’ll repeat it again: it’s not an issue of hating Canada or hating the english. It’s about our aspirations as a people.
October 6th, 2008 at 2:44 pm
Post scriptum: I have explained the “why”, I’ll come back later to answer you on: “So Jasmin, could you please explain how you envision your country if what you wish for actually did happen?”
October 6th, 2008 at 2:44 pm
So I believe North American Francophones deserve to have their own state, we need the right to self determination.
Fair enough, Jasmin. So the next obvious question would be, how do you see that state being self-supporting?
October 6th, 2008 at 2:49 pm
I’ll come back later to answer you on: “So Jasmin, could you please explain how you envision your country if what you wish for actually did happen?”
Thanks, Jasmin. I’ll look forward to it.
October 6th, 2008 at 7:50 pm
“how do you see that state being self-supporting?”
Ok, I’m not the perfect person to answer this as my economical knowledge is pretty limited. But I know Quebec has a lot of potential (especially for trade) in the energy sector. Hydro Quebec is an electricity powerhouse and sells a lot of power to ontario, maritimes and us states. They are also expanding in the wind power sector. Also, the government of Quebec is announcing a plan to develop the North where gold and uranium deposits are believed to be. And there’s also talks of oil mining possibilities north of Sept-iles.
And there’s also all the interior commerce, the aerospace sector and the technology sectors which are well present.
An independant Quebec would not be an economic powerhouse like germany or china (but it’s not like it is one right now either) but it wouldn’t be a third world economy as some people like to think.
“could you please explain how you envision your country if what you wish for actually did happen?”
I don’t foresee dramatic changes, but there would be differences.
Politically, the country should be a Republic with a proportional system of representation. Emphasis should (or would?) be put on the absence of religion in the public sphere.
It would probably be a more “leftist” (but not by that much, not to the point of venezuela or the like) state than its north american counterparts, Canada and the US.
In an independant quebec I’d probably ditch the PQ and vote for QS instead, as they are more progressive:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qu%C3%A9bec_solidaire
Socially, it would of course be a French country and be more representative of our culture and values as a nation. In short, a place I’d call my own and feel like I belong in.
I hope that answers your questions, if there is a more specific point I didn’t adress, please let me know.
October 6th, 2008 at 11:25 pm
You do, however, sadly perpetuate the stereotype of the angy, french hating canadian. You might consider that a victory, considering your twisted viewpoints.
You couldn’t be more wrong. I grew up in Quebec and have a high school diploma from there. I moved to Ontario because the rise of separatism in the ’70s made it difficult for my father to work there. Anti-anglo feelings were strong then, and expressed in rather nasty ways. I have since hired French Canadians to work with me, and count many as friends.
What is sad is the perpetuation of separatist viewpoints in Quebec, after several referenda suggesting that Quebecker don’t want it. They value their Canadian citizenship on top of their Quebec culture.
Hateful views are when your party suggests that “money and ethnic voters” are responsible for the failures of separatism.
October 7th, 2008 at 12:29 am
“Quebec, after several referenda suggesting that Quebecker don’t want it. They value their Canadian citizenship on top of their Quebec culture.”
Yeah, because 49,6% of Our population is not entitled to its opinion…
You, sir, fail at mathematics.
“Hateful views are when your party suggests that “money and ethnic voters” are responsible for the failures of separatism.”
Yes, because the whole ideology of Quebec independentism revolves around a sentence pronounced by Parizeau while he was drunk. Once again, you proved to have a lot of preconceived ideas and will bend the truth in away to prove your narrow minded viewpoint.
So i’ll just leave you to your rambles.
I’m just gonna ignore you because you seem like you are not a person worth trying to discuss with.
So I’ll leave you to your hatred of “the Evil english hating frenchmen”. Ring me up when you come back to reality.
October 7th, 2008 at 8:23 am
[...] from Margaret Atwood, the outraged Canadian writer who is begging for more of our tax-dollars while supporting the separatists: …Doesn’t Mr. Harper understand that some kids have lethal allergies? Doesn’t he [...]
October 7th, 2008 at 8:27 am
Jasmin, I haven’t forgotten about you. Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I’ll try to respond later today. Lots going on.
October 8th, 2008 at 7:21 pm
Jamin, all I can say is that after watching the way the polls are going, I have new respect and understanding for your position.
October 8th, 2008 at 7:31 pm
If discussion like this can help two people understand each others position then it was a constructive thing
October 8th, 2008 at 7:36 pm
Thank you, Jasmin. It’s been a pleasure and I’ve learned a lot.
October 9th, 2008 at 7:25 pm
So i’ll just leave you to your rambles.
Go away for a few days, and things get silly.
Of course you will leave me to my rambles, as you’re unable to refute them, with ample evidence from your personal attacks on me.
How drunk do you have to be to be considered a racist? Is it 1 beer? 2? Perhaps 3 or 4? Of course, Parizeau was only kidding, he had a couple Scotch and waters before he stood up to the media and said that. I understand completely.
I’d love to know where a separatist sets the goalposts.
October 9th, 2008 at 11:45 pm
Ça me prend aucune bière pour que les gens comme toi commencent à me faire croire à une justification au racisme.
October 10th, 2008 at 4:32 pm
Ça me prend aucune bière pour que les gens comme toi commencent à me faire croire à une justification au racisme.
As I suspected, you continue to justify racism, based on alcohol consumption.
C’est dommage, mais…I understand why the PQ doesn’t even campaign on separatism anymore…the slow decline of Quebec separatism is a gift to both Canada and Quebec.